Jody Sperling is a fiction writer, and one of the few who at one time has had a literary agent to represent his book to publishers. But after failing to attract a willing publisher, in his words, his “dream wilted.” He ultimately went on to found the podcast The Reluctant Book Marketer, appealing to people such as himself who have tried and tried to get published by a traditional publisher, but never succeeded. He now tries to help writers with their marketing mindset. We had a great conversation—Jody is thoughtful and articulate and open—that ranged well beyond the vagaries and frustrations of publishing. Please listen.